I want to learn how to implant a nucleus in a clam

Now don't forget that I'm in the nuclei business. So put your order in early. I would like to tell you that my nuclei won't irritate the oyster. But if that were true what would be the point. They wouldn't try to coat it with nacre. :D Sorry Octavia. But thems the rules.
 
Mikeyy said:
Now don't forget that I'm in the nuclei business. So put your order in early. I would like to tell you that my nuclei won't irritate the oyster. But if that were true what would be the point. They wouldn't try to coat it with nacre. :D Sorry Octavia. But thems the rules.
Click to expand...

Octavia doesn't believe in implants. :rolleyes:
 
I wish you all the luck in the world - but like my misguided dog Maya, I believe you are barking up the wrong tree.
 
kb2rocket said:
question once the nucleus and mantle tissue is inserted wouldnt it be a good Idea to put a stitch on the incsission to keep the animal from rejecting the nucleus?
Click to expand...

This post seemed to create quite a debate revolving around PAIN and Humane practices, ethics...the whole thing. Let's see if I can help settle this debate as a Scientist and Pearl Farmer/Producer and Grafter. RocketBoy: nobody has been offended here. Caitlin has said the truth: this is a forum, a place to share ideas and knowledge. Your questions -placing aside the questions that have a more "commercial" value (such as: producing "non-valuable cultured calcium concretions" or "clam shells") have a certain validity. So, I feel abligated to answer some of your questions.

First, Pearl Oysters, Mussels, Mollusks in general (altough I would set aside all Cephalopods -Octopus and Calamari- aside) don't FEEL PAIN. This is hard to explain because we think and feel in Human terms...but let us try to place it in context:
These creatures don't have a REAL BRAIN. They don't think (almost like a politician...sorry for the pun, but we are almost in an election year and I am already FED UP!!) and are not conciouss of their existence. They FEEL things: a touch, a gentle probing a deep knife stab...we know because we can see the animal's reaction, but we can't see any intensity (is it worst to be touched than cut?) except in the duration of the stimulus on the animal's tissues (mainly the mantle). Also, they don't have any memory...for us pain can be relieved by remembering, and it is also why we avoid pain. Oysters barely have small nervous ganglions...they are almost like Plants (actually, think of oysters like plants that have a digestive system).

Second, PAIN KILLERS AND STITCHING. We have tried stitching the oysters and saw no real improvement (mortality rates were the same, pearl production remained the same). We used medical grade cyanoacrilate (crazy glue). A friend of mine (H?ctor Acosta Salm?n) stitched his oysters with cat-gut and even inmersed them in Paracetamol (Tylenol)...no differences seen. Doing this adds extra time to the operation itself so it is not good production wise.

Third, STRESS is a Fact of Life. This is the real killer. Asides from bacteria and problems during the seeding operation...stress will kill the oysters and if it doesn't kill them it will help produce a low quality pearl. What causes stress? pollution, extreme water temperatures, salinity changes, human handling, disease, lowered food availability... what doesn't cause any stress: love & relationships, child rearing, inflation, politicians, social status. Once more: they don't have brains.
 
I might point out that it really doesn't matter if you use a nuclei or not to grow a pearl. In the end the reason the oyster coats it is because it is an irritant. Sand, tissue or nuclei. If the oyster had feet it would go to the dentist for an extraction. Well if they had brains
 
CortezPearls said:
Once more: they don't have brains.
Click to expand...

Well, they got something. They will probably still be here 50 years from now when mankind's existence will be put to the test. Their strategy seems to be passivity and it will probably work too.

Anyway, no one has answered: "Do crabs not have vision because they lack the visual centres of humans?"

And: "Do bivalves not feel pain because they lack the brain of a vertebrate?"

Slraep
 
And why is it that when they are mad they clam up? Anger. And why do they lay in bed all day? Depression. And have you ever heard the expression "Happy as a clam"? How could they have all of these emotions without a brain? No I think more research is in order.
 
Mikeyy said:
And why is it that when they are mad they clam up? Anger. And why do they lay in bed all day? Depression. And have you ever heard the expression "Happy as a clam"? How could they have all of these emotions without a brain? No I think more research is in order.
Click to expand...

Very funny. But you can't answer it either, eh?

What about this? Shrimp don't have eyes like ours. Their eyesight cannot compare to a human's. Really? Maybe it's human eyesight that is primative and cannot compare to a shrimp's. You tell me. I think humans are quite silly in their assumptions. Dumb, actually.

This was apparently a 'first" for any animal. Yah, that's because humans just cannot imagine that any creature is more complex than they are, especially a lowly mantis shrimp.

"Dr Sonja Kleinlogel and Professor Andrew White have shown that mantis shrimp not only have the ability to see colours from the ultraviolet through to the infrared, but have optimal polarisation vision -- a first for any animal and a capability that humanity has only achieved in the last decade using fast computer technology.

"The two scientists have shown that shrimp of the species Gonodactylus smithii have eyes that simultaneously measure four linear and two circular polarisations, enabling them to determine both the direction of the oscillation, as well as how polarised the light is."

"Each eye measures the six polarisation components that are precisely required for optimal polarisation vision. In fact, the physics we used to understand what was going on is the same physics that we use in quantum computing for optimal storage of information."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/05/080513210456.htm

Slraep
 
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Third, STRESS is a Fact of Life. This is the real killer. Asides from bacteria and problems during the seeding operation...stress will kill the oysters and if it doesn't kill them it will help produce a low quality pearl. What causes stress? pollution, extreme water temperatures, salinity changes, human handling, disease, lowered food availability... what doesn't cause any stress: love & relationships, child rearing, inflation, politicians, social status. Once more: they don't have brains.

You do mean the politicians about the brain, don?t you?
 
Sorry. Did not mean to offend re comments or banter. All in good nature I assure you. Just trying to work out if it is really a clam mis-labelled as Pinctada Maxima or what. Can't see how that they can firstly get a PM to sell, or get one to survive in a tank. Apologies.
 
oops. sorry. wrong thread! That's what you get for being up at 3am!
 
I would like to make up a really good story and run with it. But we're talking 2yo, 4yo and 3 month puppy all up and screaming. Mummy on business trip and no way near enough alcohol to cover me!!

Apologise on every thread.......now ya talking!
 
George, now you must be really appreciative when Mummy is at home, running things smoothly?
 
Wish I could say yes but she's the high flying corporate and I'm the full time worker and full time mummy/daddy. Still it could have been worse. the 6YO could have been screaming also. I guess there's always tonight!!
 
Well, George,

You gave me a first class chuckle this am!!
Pattye
so many pearls, so little time
 
Here's another article on the primitive mantis shrimp's eyesight.

So now they figure the creatures can also see 11-12 primary colours while we think our 3 are da bomb. Imagine what a rainbow would look like if we had multi-primary colour super vision. Too bad. Our poor and limited eyesight just cannot measure up. I think a mantis shrimp might find we are blind in comparison.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2008/05/080519-shrimp-colors.html

Slraep
 
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