Supplies and advice please

[Kelly]

Hi everyone:

I have been going over tons of info here about knotting, and I know that the info is here somewhere, but I've got 2 small kids and a messy house...could someone cut to the chase for me - I'd be ever so grateful.

I'm in Victoria (Canada) and the only silk available is Griffin on a card with needle attached. I learned how to know tweezer method. Went ok, sometimes tension issues though, and I found my knots to be kind of small. I'd like to knot with the two thread method so I can get the tension nice and tight. Where would I order (is it Gudebrod?) and I guess needles? What are the sizes of each I should be looking for? I imagine the thread will have to be quite fine if a doubled thread is going to have to pass back through the pearls for starting and finishing?

I've looked up so many sites and it's tweezer, tweezer, tweezer. Your help would sure be welcome.

 

[pattye]

Hi Kelly,

Here is one of the discussion threads about Stringing and Knotting.

Unfortunately, there is no really simple formula. Pearl holes are different sizes partly depending on the size of the pearls, and it's trial and error to figure out what size thread works for each strand. Reaming the pearls slightly at the end of the strand will enlarge the hole to make it easier for the thread to pass back through the pearl.

Right now Gudebrod company is not in production, so it is difficult to find their silk. Some of us use powerpro, or another synthetic, too. Perhaps some of our other knotters will list what they are finding as good substitutes. Certainly Griffin on the card is an option.

I am a fairly new knotter, and like the wire needles with a large eye.

I am using the 2 thread method, no tweezers or tool, and also purchased Pearl and Bead Stringing with Henrietta by Henrietta Virchick, available in paperback. There are some knotting videos on You Tube also worth watching.

Hope some others with more experience will chime in here, Good Luck!

 

[kojimapearl]

Dear Kelly,
Pattye is correct about the "trial and error" method of finding the right size thread.
The "general rule" I was taught about finding the right size of thread is : when the pearl does not fall down the thread, then the knots will big enough.
As for thread, I have never used Power Pro...but sooooo many people here use it and talk about its ease.
I make my own needles out of copper wire filaments. At most any hardware store, you can buy electrical wire by the foot (or meter).. inspect them in the store and make sure there are tonnes of tiny filaments. You can cut these to whatever length you like, and twist them into a needle... then double them up if they are not strong enough.(the best part is that they are removable) Endless needles for pennies! It's usually used to rewire lamps. It's the same concept as the needle at the end of the "cards" of silk... but these work better with doubled thread. I have always steered clear of the "cards" of silk, as they tend to twist up, and need to be pre-stretched.. but with Gudebrod dwindling, maybe still the best bet for certain projects.
Hope this helps a bit!
Good luck!
Sarah

 

[pearlescence]

Hi
We used the carded 2m lengths with needles for nearly everything, switching to a similar synthetic product for very large pearls or where we know the customer is silk destructive(!)
Try using a needle into the knot to keep it manoeverable and to slide it right up to where you want it rather than faff around with tweezers. i find a longish but fine as you can get darning needle is the best. the finer the needle the neater the knots.
The silk is stronger too because of the optimum twist, like 2 or 4 ply knitting wool

 

[Kelly]

These are exactly the kinds of tips I'm looking for. I'm one grateful little oyster (bivalve?).

 

[pearlescence]

It is a popular product on our website, I'm poised to start selling it Pearlescence branded (and cheaper!)

 

[pattye]

Wendy,

What product do you mean?

 

[pearlescence]

Griffin silks

Wendy,

What product do you mean?

 

[pattye]

That's cool!

 

[Kelly]

Pattye, can you tell me more about this 'reaming the pearls at the end of the strand' business. I think I will have to do that. I own a dremel, but need a bit more instruction on the type of drill bit to use and how to go about it (if that's what you do?). Do you use a clamp of some sort to hold the pearl steady?

Also, what is a good source for powerpro? (Your patience is appreciated).

 

[pearlescence]

If you have a lifetime to spare you can faff around with a reamer, the tip of which will always break inside the pearl eventually. Get a 1mm drill bit and put that in your household drill and enlarge the hole with that. You will drill your thumb as well a few times but soon learn (the bit will also break inside the pearl a few times but you will get better at that as well and you will not have spent hours twirling a reamer beforehand)
We use such a drill, rather than trying to put the pearls into the pearl drill and line up the hole.

 

[pattye]

As to sources for powerpro or synthetic yarn, you might try a google search for an online store in Canada, or call some of your local bead supply shops to see if they carry it.

 

[junebug]

I googled for the Power Pro for you and came up with http://www.artbeads.com. They ship to Canada for a song. $1.99. I have not ordered from them before.
I would like to try it myself as I've only heard good things on here but I think it only comes in white and green. I wonder why there isn't black.
I can't help you with the sizes as I have not used it myself but when I first started with silk I just bought a roll each from B-F and figured that what I was saving in paying for classes I could spend on material experimentation. Now that I hear Gudebrod is not producing I kind of wish I had bought a few more rolls of each.

I have to say though, the B was mostly useless as it made knots that were too small for my needs and just kept breaking under my clumsy Newbie knots - but at least I know.
Hope this helps.

 

[Kelly]

Hey that's great. Thanks for the heads up. I'd be very surprised if powerpro is available here. Love my country, hate the lack of supplies for, well, you name it. Can't beat $1.99 if I need to order. Never seen Gudebrod around, and not likely to now. Griffin silk in limited colors (maybe 6). They have numbered sizes and I used #4 as I recall. Knots were smallish which is why I want to try the double knot method. Classes not offered. You can go to the local bead stores and they will show you the tweezer method, which I did. I've googled and youtubed a whole lot more of tweezing. Again, thanks for all of your advice. I welcome every little bit.

Just as an aside. I have found that I love knotting. Very relaxing and meditative. Others too?

 

[pattye]

I order quite a few supply and finding items from artbeads.com and find them reliable and pretty reasonable costwise. They frequently offer specials and discounts on various items, so it's good to be on their mailing list.

I recall being told D & E size (doubled) are the most common size thread for knotting pearls. I am a latecomer to knotting and appreciate all the tips given here too!

The green powerpro looks pretty good with most peacock black pearls and tahitians, imo.

 

[pattye]

Kelly,

Wendy has a great suggestion about using your drill with a small drill bit. I will try that also. I am NOT experienced with my dremel at all, but want to try it with the small bit. (Haven't gotten any bits small enough as yet.)

So awhile back I bought a small battery driven reamer. It has interchangeable diamond tips. It has helped me get the feel of drilling into the pearl. No drilled finger tips as yet! I have plenty of not so great pearls to practice on.

 

[pearlescence]

You would perhaps be better with an ordinary hosuehold put up shelves drill, the dremel might be a bit underpowered. I tried a similar piece of kit first and it just wasn't powerful enough. We use just ordinary 1mm bits - becaue they wear out after about 10 pearls, like pearl drill bits

 

[Caitlin]

Suzanne Hye still has a bit of grudebrod silk spools left, mostly in the F's. All the E has disappeared since the last time I linked it. Suzanne also carries power-pro. She is trustworthy and knowledgeable. Her mentor, Henrietta, is the author of the book Pattye mentioned, though I think she carries a video by Henrietta too.

Artbeads has less stuff than a findings site, but they have always been fast and reliable. I have ordered from them lots of times.

 

[junebug]

Thanks for the votes of confidence for Artbeads. There's always a danger in recommending a company to someone when hasn't ordered from it before. Very good of everyone to chime in.

I'm very curious to try Powerpro although I always seem to think 'fishing line' when I hear the name.

I was thinking what the moss green, of all colours, would be useful for and thanks to Patteye I can see that they might suit the Tahitians.

I so wish they had a pink Powerpro as I managed to get some pink silk before they stopped making it and found it actually works quite well. I was inspired by Tiffany's Breast Cancer campaign to try pink silk between white pearls.

The carded silks look expensive for a beginner like me. I have very shamefully wasted yards and yards of silk in my knotting endeavours and now that it is out of production I feel quite awful about it.

I do recommend a class in knotting if you can, Kelly, because it really did take me about a year before I was confident enough to show my pearls to the Lowly Beader's here. I actually use the tweezers method myself and while it was hard in the beginning, one gets used to it.

Jeremy had a video link on here somewhere to a Chinese girl who was knotting a USD250K strand (!) and they were huge pearls. All she did was use two strings, no tweezers or tools. I don't know how she did that but it seemed the easiest thing ever. I think it helps if you are bit of a crochet or knitting person. I'm actually more of a baking person.

 

[Narcissa]

I used a dremel-type tool b/c it was easier to hold steady than my full size drill. Used it with 1mm diamond coated bits, which lasted for maybe just a few pearls if I remember right. A very small amount of blood was shed.