Bought more - this time retail (ouch?)

[operavopera]

That is quite expensive, really. How find are those diamonds and what is the carat weight? Most people do not realize that small diamonds can cost just a few dollars - even in a decent quality.

Just called the jeweler. She said that they are 5 points each, total 20points, G-H color, VS2. The cost is $1,795 per karat, or $89.75 each and they are only charging me $75 each. I still hope that I'm not being overcharged, since they tell me that I'm one their best customers and that they don't make much profit on me.

I went to that website, Zeide, and all of the diamonds that I saw were I-2 to I-3.

 

[jshepherd]

The pinks on that Site are all pale pinks. In a value comparison it is like a thin-skin blemished Akoya compared to a Hanadama certified strand. Here is a decent list, and I have seen others that quote quite a bit higher as well:
http://www.color-diamond-encyclopedia.com/?st=new&f=ct_EN_3_3.html

I cannot remember where I found a graph detaling the rise in prices (it was online). But prices have jumped astronomically in the past decade.

Operavopera,

The prices quoted to you on the diamonds are triple keystone (retail). I just checked with my diamond dealers list, and although the sizes are too small to show on Rapaport, a good estimate would be $700 per carat, or about $35 per stone. My cost on the stones would be approximately $500 per carat for VS2 G-H, or about $25 per stone. Granted I get a pretty good deal, typically near 30% under rap, but no dealers pay higher than rap unless it is a stone that is hard to get.

I should probably make this disclaimer, however. I do not deal in diamonds, but I use some diamonds with pearls. I do not mind helping customers or friends with their diamonds, however. I just do not want to be inundated with diamond requests.

 

[Zeide Erskine]

Hi Opera,

You have to look through long lists to find the higher clarity or you have to ask Balu. Any diamond lower than SI is really rubble and should not have any money wasted on it at all.

The price for diamonds looks too steep. I doubt they are making their own settings and the pre-fab Stuller ones have the diamonds already in them.

Zeide

 

[jshepherd]

Found some graphs on this Site. You should note that the graphs end about 5 years ago. Prices have been continuing North ever since.

http://www.colored-diamonds.com/page11.htm

 

[Zeide Erskine]

Hi Jeremy,

I recommend postponing the purchase of an fancy pinks until the next recession peaks and they pop up on the secondary market in large quantities.

Zeide

 

[Satine De La Courcel]

I wonder when this price explosion for fancy colors happened. Before the Bennifer engagement ring, even larger fancy pinks were not fetching more than US$40,000.00 per carat and below 2 carats it was even less than that. Thousands for a half-carat? When did that happen?


Hi Zeide,

I forst notices th big price jump when Kopbe Bryant bought his wifet hat 4 million Purple diamond for all the drama a few years back.. but that is when I noticed it.... tht seems about the time of Bennifer 1, LOL


Cheers

Ash

 

[perlas]

The pinks on that Site are all pale pinks. In a value comparison it is like a thin-skin blemished Akoya compared to a Hanadama certified strand. Here is a decent list, and I have seen others that quote quite a bit higher as well:
http://www.color-diamond-encyclopedia.com/?st=new&f=ct_EN_3_3.html

If I may chime in, natural pinks are usually light pink because the pink coloration is mostly due to deformities in the crystal formation of the diamond, unlike blues which are due to traces of boron, yellows due to nitrogen atoms, and greens due to irradiation.

Black diamonds are due to inclusions and are very cheap. They usually come in big sizes of a carat or more.

Fancy colored diamonds tend to be lighter in smaller sizes thus most seem lighter in melees. A diamond of the same color saturation e.g. light pink would look "pinker" in bigger, say .5 to 1ct. sizes. I wouldn't be surprised if the Bennifer ring would turn light pink when converted to melees. Same goes for "white diamonds". The brown and yellow colors will be more visible in bigger stones but would look "whiter" in melees.

Although most fancy colored diamonds are enhanced by HPHT treatment, not all will produce the same color. If treatment is by irradiation, then the length of treatment time may determine or add saturation to the color. As far as I know, Type IIa diamonds are best candidates for HPHT treatment. If let's say natural cape (brown) diamonds are about USD1000/ct., then the enhanced canaries which are usually heated capes will cost more because of the enhancement procedures.

When heating capes, the color outcome may turn into canaries or whiter diamonds. It's much like heating natural corundum, you cannot know what the color will be after heating.

Fancy colored diamond melees, like pearls, requires matching. So nice, same colored melees in a ring is not that bad. The pinks are especially harder to match than the canaries, the lemons, the capes, and the greens.

 

[Zeide Erskine]

Hi Sam,

I recently picked up a nice ring with 0.75cttw of 1 pointers in VS light pinks in rose gold (only for the design, otherwise I would have preferred pink sapphire) for under US$ 500.00 at auction (Bob Weinman Generations 1912). The chips look much pinker in daylight than in incandescent light. I am totally in love with the design, though.

 

[Valeria101]

Lovely ring!

Plain to see what you liked in it

Is there a signature on it? The design reminds me strongly of a certain designer's work and I can't possibly pin down the name right now... Ugh!



I'd bet the diamonds are not treated if that light (taken out of the pink gold, and the faint color should become apparent).

Now, strong pink color, fine cut and matched would have been a different story. Isn't that what the previous notes on this thread might have been about?

Sometimes 'light pink' is used even for melee to note barely there color, lighter than 'fancy light'. Perhaps that's what is happening with the 1k/ct pointers. It would explain things for me. Example? Say, THIS for light pink but not fancy, and getting visible color even in much smaller size w/o treatment is definitely on another scale (Example, from same seller). Not many post realistic fancy color prices online... sadly so.

Have yet to find faintly colored treated diamonds. they're always very vivid looking - easy to spot for that matter (otherwise, where on earth to find a handful of vivid pink melee to begin with?).

As much as I know...

 

[perlas]

Zeide,
Lovely ring and design. I think that "pink diamond chips" are still harder to come by than a half a carat fine "white" diamond whether natural or color-enhanced.

Valeria,
Although coating diamonds to improve color is frowned upon, this sometimes happens in let's say "S-Z" diamonds to make them "more yellow" or "pinkish" or put a tinge of blue on them. You do not necessarily have to coat the whole diamond. A dot of color in proper places maybe in the pavilion can add color.

Since manganese is the "colorant" for red diamonds, manganese traces can give a vivid pink in natural pinks, but this is very rare. Like if you see red pearls, they're usually dyed but it doesn't mean they don't exist.

Some natural yellow and orangy diamonds (.5ct up) that I've seen are actually pique with no sparkle. Although nice sparkly ones are also available.

I've noticed that the color-enhanced diamonds have a metallic feel to them (sorry for lack of a better term).

You are right. A lot of diamond melees in even vivid colors is most likely
enhanced.

Cape even in big sizes is affordable but treatment can now make them "whiter" and "greener", so natural brownies soon maybe scarce.

Even lab-grown diamonds such as Gemesis' canaries are expensive!

 

[Zeide Erskine]

Hi Sam & Ana,

The above ring is a fully hallmarked, signed, and has been individually essayed for the British market. It is a Bob Weinman ring from the Generations 1912 line. It was a cheap second because some of the pink diamond chips were set askew. I paid exactly US$428.00 for it. I did not buy it for its cost-of-materials value or some other collectible feature but simply because I absolutely adore the design. About everything I can think of is different than the cookie-cutter things you see everywhere.

Zeide

 

[operavopera]

Hi Opera,

The surcharge for 4 diamond chips is so beyond ridiculous that I can hardly fathom it. This is not going to be a custom setting. They are just gluing the pearls into a pre-fab semi-mount. The semi-mount in 14k will cost something around US$90.00 wholesale from the Stuller catalog. That is already including 4 diamond chips that come with the setting from the manufacturer. If you want to really annoy your jeweler you buy yourself a suite of fancy color diamonds chips in a rainbow assortment from www.alphagems.com (get the phone number, ask for Balu Khatod, call him Prince and tell him Bagheera referred you) and he'll pick a whole carat worth of mele? in fine color and clarity for about US$100. Then kindly ask your generous jeweler to set their "free custom" mounting with these.

Zeide

As it turns out, I was able to get a much better deal on the same quality diamonds somewhere else. My jeweler will still set them for me and they have assured me that it is a custom, handmade setting, and that all of their jewelry is handmade and designed by the jeweler onsite. (They did design a pair of Tahitian earrings for me several years ago and they look pretty custom to me). When I get the earrings back I will post a picture! Thank you for all of the advice! You all saved me again!