How much color difference is acceptable?

[Nihal]

Hi,
I am only a pearl-lover since childhood. I recently developed some trust in shopping pearls online. I wish I had known this platform a year ago.
I have been looking for lilac-lavender-purple pearls for a year. Each excitement turned into a big heartbreak due to the colors. I am well aware of the difficulty of taking pearl pictures. For that reason, I try to take all precautions:
1) analyze pics on different screens to evaluate colors, luster, overtones and aurora since each electronics has its own adjustments.
2) read carefully the sellers explanations about the conditions during picturing like indoor, outdoor, natural light source…etc
3) mostly prefer products with videos in addition to the pics.
4) read reviews
5) importantly in case of any discrepancy between the title and description, I stay away from that seller. Let me give you an example (jewelry making) that I frequently see on ETSY > title:
‘14K SOLID GOLD, or REAL GOLD chain for jewelry making’
Then, I scroll down to the product description and features where the seller states that:
‘STERLING SILVER, or (worse) BRASS plated with 14K GOLD’
Above is not acceptable since the title deceives for 14K REAL GOLD. A person lies at the very first step WILL LIE at any step. That is my personal ethics and free-will not shop at that shop. Please no offense, anyone may choose to shop the way they wish. Nothing is only black and white, in fact there are so many grey areas as well as buffering colors in life.
6) I personally take pictures/videos of the received pearls with different conditions, indoor, various light resource, different angles and background (like white, black, against a particular object) to fairly judge pearl color, overtones, aurora, luster and surface quality.

Here is my worry: I paid $130 for a pair of purple pearls - my misfortune to shop at Etsy. Unfortunately those are my 4th attempt to buy lavender-purple pearls in less than 6 months. Again and again feeling deceived. Here is the exact picture from seller - no edit by me. The following pics are the ones I received and pearls are pictured at different angles in the evening and during day, no light is on at the day time, blinds are open, white and black as well as dimly-lighted or shadowed environment. Nothing close to the seller’s pic.

Only when closely pictured pics are more purple but not in reality. They are way muted lighter colors. Although two pearls will never be same, I expected them to be closer in color and shape due being labeled as a pair. In some pics, color difference is very obvious, one is mauve-pink and other is dark bluish purple with no warm purple color, nor pink and metallic overtones. Just reiterating for my pics that pearls in person are way paler and muted colors- not too dark.
Also tested them as I learnt here: tooth test. I am highly inexperienced about the authenticity tests. I could not decide. They don’t feel like scrubbing lightly against a sand with tooth test. I don’t know what degree is enough about gritty described here. Besides, they are not too heavy for that size of pearls and never felt too cold - not warm neither cold in between.
Thus I emailed the seller about the color and my doubts of the authenticity.

 

[Pearl Dreams]

I understand your frustration. Pearls sold as purple or lavender are often a bit more brownish than you might expect based on photos.
Also a number of FW pearls sold as purple will fade over time. Some have been dyed, and sometimes the vendor is not aware of that.

Also, monitors vary. The color you see on your screen may not be what another person would see on theirs.

 

[Nihal]

Here was the seller’s first response:

“You may send it to a third party for appraisal if you have doubts about the authenticity.
As a senior member of freshwater pearl association, it’s my first time encountered a buyer questioning the authenticity of pearls.
The original listing is marked as sold is because these are not stock photos. Each listing has unique item No., and buyer gets the exact pearl pair or pearl strand. The photos are shoot by Cannon camera under lighting box so the color is more subtle. We can get any listing certified but it is in Chinese.”

First if the exact one send, how come they are not at least half way closer to the seller’s pic, no metallic shades, or obvious warmth?

The worst, the seller admits that photos are shoot by Cannon camera under LIGHTING BOX - as if the deception is from cameras and lighting boxes. I responded and in short wrote that:

“… I strongly believe that pictures must be showing closer to the reality of the products. … there are notes on…pearl seller’s page similar to below:
‘Colors may differ on different screen’ … I examine each pearls on different screen before buying.
… Here, you used Cannon under light box. Surely, YOU ARE AWARE that combo ENHANCES PICS not slightly, RATHER AT A VERY HIGH LEVEL… results are highly saturated, shiny and changed colors of deceptive pictures. It is SELLER’s RESPONSIBILITY to capture objects in real colors and shapes at best. From your answer, I grasp that you already know that those pearls do not reflect the real colors.
…… they are darker than in reality (in my pics) - one of them is darker peach-mauve with slight pink tones. The only purple is in at the top which can be seen only in the pic, not in person under daylight. Nothing close to your pics, like warm and rich purple.
Your argument of taking pics under light box DOES NOT MAKE A LEGIT SENSE. I am not going to wear them under a light box.”

Please, as experts in pearls what do you think? How much color difference should be expected?
Of course lightning in a way is used for every pictures. In this case, how can I accept that huge color difference as the seller puts all the weight on CANNON camera & lighting box?
I am a Ph.D who used CANNON camera for imaging human cells and transparent organism which are mutated to express fluorescence (shining with green, cyan, red). I am trained on manipulation/adjustment of light sources due to working with fluorescence. Do you think the seller’s explanation is ok?

What are your suggestions?

By the way, after two days of mailing, he offers those:
‘
Here is two possible solution:
1. Partial discount. I can do 15% discount refund.
2.Return for full refund. You will be responsible for return shipping cost and the safety of the pearl pair. The refund will be issued when we get the pearl pair back safe and sound’

He puts it on me like everything matches to the product description. As if I did not like it, so I have to pay. According to your advice, I can apply Etsy to open a case to investigate this. However, I don’t want to harm anyone for something beyond my analysis.

 

[Nihal]

I understand your frustration. Pearls sold as purple or lavender are often a bit more brownish than you might expect based on photos.
Also a number of FW pearls sold as purple will fade over time. Some have been dyed, and sometimes the vendor is not aware of that.

Also, monitors vary. The color you see on your screen may not be what another person would see on theirs.

I am aware of all those.
The part you mention about fading, that is not acceptable from the customer perspective: it is saying that I will receive what is in the picture. Hence, I am ordering a new set, not complaining such as after 6 month the pearl colors faded.
QUALITY ASSURANCE (QA); The seller has to confirm the product quality as called here - that is valid in every type trade. For that reason, on the market, even TOYOTA called back the MATRIX models for break failures a few years ago in US
If I am supposed to accept that, let me say that is against the trade regulations regardless of the product value or number.

 

[Nihal]

I question whether that much difference can be accepted? Why that is not noted on the product page? I am only told the enhancement because I complain about the color. Is this the way PEARL INDUSTRY work?
I doubt the latter. I did shopped in stores. Sometimes, just asked for a product that I saw online. Never that kind of color difference. Seller’s and my color descriptions are on different categories:
A) shown in real purple with metallic, red to pink overtones. Ps: red color in fact gives rich and warm purple. Silver overtones will result in dark bluish color which is a lighter version of one of the purples.
B) in my own term, they should be labeled as peach to pink to mauve for one and the other in bluish purple with a note that they are slightly lighter with little metallic look.
I hope I was able explain the color difference, so you may understand my struggle in accepting the seller’s explanation.

Also, let me ask that too: I tried so hard, even under bright white light, why can’t I capture the seller’s color in my own pics?

Doesn’t those put together disprove the seller’s color explanation?

 

[Pearl Dreams]

It seems to be common seller practice that pearls are photographed under ideal lighting conditions, including studio lighting / light box. This sort of lighting brings out overtone colors that are actually present in the pearls, but which the buyer may see only under ideal diffuse light conditions (outdoor shade, indoor natural light etc.)
We certainly do not live in a light box. But we can't expect sellers not to photograph their pearls to advantage, either. It isn't deception if the colors are actually present in the pearls, even if they only show up under ideal light conditions. As buyers it is up to us to educate ourselves about how pearl colors behave in different lighting. This helps us to have realistic expectations.

We can ask sellers for some natural diffuse light photos-- but I find that even then the pearls may not look the same in my own home. I have Tahitians that look different in every room of my house. Which is the true color? They all are!

I find that Tahitians and colored freshwater pearls are most likely to have overtone colors that are best seen in diffuse light. I factor this into my expectations of how these pearls will look in my own environment.

You may be happier buying pearls in person, but even then, the lighting in the shop or at the jewelry show may affect what the color looks like.
I saw a lovely strand of Tahitians that had fabulous bluish overtones-- that vanished when I took the strand nearer the window.

It can be frustrating to buy pearls.
By the way the pearls in your first post do look like authentic freshwater pearls.

 

[Pearl Dreams]

I am messaging you a link to the Cultured Pearls Association's "Pearls As One" course that you may enjoy taking, with a code to take it for free.

 

[Pearl Dreams]

I just want to add this: We have all bought pearls we were less than thrilled with.
Even if they are just what we expected, they may not look as good against our skin as we thought they would.

Therefore it's best to buy from reputable vendors who have generous return policies, and to be prepared to send them back if we don't love what we got.
It's all part of the cost of the hobby.
Edited to add: I don't buy from anywhere I am not prepared to ship back to with tracking. I don't buy from China any more.

 

[Yens]

Senior member of the pearl association eh? What's their etsy page? Where was the item shipped from?

 

[StarryPearl]

Just like @Pearl Dreams said, lightbox photographing is a common practice. We want to see the best of the pearls, too, in order to get the most information about their colors, luster, etc. By comparing pictures and real pearls, we accumulate experience on what to expect for future images.

The pearls in your pics look authentic freshwater to me, too.

As to fading, according to earlier discussions on this forum, dyed purple pearls do not fade, natural color ones do (or at least some of them?). That sounds discouraging and unfortunate. But "acceptable" or not, that's what the mussles are producing right now, that's how far the farming technology gets right now. Too bad you cannot beat up the mussles to take back their pearls and fix the colors "correct".

Amber yellows and dries over the years. Coral dulls. Pearls changes, too, some types quicker than others. That's what they are. You consider it unacceptable, seller offered you partial refund or return. Buying in person as @Pearl Dreams suggested is a great idea. Or, maybe you can wait a few years for the development of pearl cultivation technology. Maybe one day they'll figure out how to have the mussles make this beautiful violet that doesn't fade. I have confidence in them.

 

[Yens]

It is entirely possible to get darker color purple. Fading usually occurs on younger mussels that produce these pearls. If mussels are 3-4 years old, the color seems to be better. Also nacre shows less imperfections such as birthmarks. It's rarer to see this type of quality on Etsy as the site seems to compete for price rather than quality. Source from a pearl professional and you won't be disappointed.

Above pairs were shot w/ Samsung phone + a 5500k light overhead. Pretty much resemblance of daylight.

 

[LorenLL]

Senior member of the pearl association eh? What's their etsy page? Where was the item shipped from?

The shop is called LucasPearl. The seller called himself Mark and he claims to work in Qiujiaan, Wenling, where he also ships his pearls from. He also claims that he was in the pearl business for 15 years.

 

[Yens]

The shop is called LucasPearl. The seller called himself Mark and he claims to work in Qiujiaan, Wenling, where he also ships his pearls from. He also claims that he was in the pearl business for 15 years.

ahh, another one of those...

 

[LorenLL]

ahh, another one of those...

I am totally unfamiliar with the pearl business in China so could you please elaborate?

 

[LorenLL]

I question whether that much difference can be accepted? Why that is not noted on the product page? I am only told the enhancement because I complain about the color. Is this the way PEARL INDUSTRY work?
I doubt the latter. I did shopped in stores. Sometimes, just asked for a product that I saw online. Never that kind of color difference. Seller’s and my color descriptions are on different categories:
A) shown in real purple with metallic, red to pink overtones. Ps: red color in fact gives rich and warm purple. Silver overtones will result in dark bluish color which is a lighter version of one of the purples.
B) in my own term, they should be labeled as peach to pink to mauve for one and the other in bluish purple with a note that they are slightly lighter with little metallic look.
I hope I was able explain the color difference, so you may understand my struggle in accepting the seller’s explanation.

Also, let me ask that too: I tried so hard, even under bright white light, why can’t I capture the seller’s color in my own pics?

Doesn’t those put together disprove the seller’s color explanation?

The quickest way to find out is to buy a LED light box and look at the pearls there. I played with light box shooting before, and I could tell you that objects never looks the same in light box vs under "normal" light, because white LED is blindingly bright, much closer to the object and the colour rendering index is different from your light source. The white background of the light box also reflects light to every side of the object, including the bottom, which "brightens" it and makes the colour more vivid. Given that your pearls showed the same hue (albeit in a much darker tone) as the sample picture when they were near the window, it is entirely possible for them to look very similar under a much brighter and "colder" light shone from all directions, the typical condition a LED light box offers.

Pearls are notorious for showing vastly different colours in various light conditions even when seen with naked eyes, so it is difficult to say how much of the colour difference is acceptable. The same applies to other gemstones with play-of-light, so I always avoid buying this type of gemstones online unless there is absolutely no other alternatives, or I feel generous about the acceptable level of difference between the photo and the real item.

 

[Nihal]

It seems to be common seller practice that pearls are photographed under ideal lighting conditions, including studio lighting / light box. This sort of lighting brings out overtone colors that are actually present in the pearls, but which the buyer may see only under ideal diffuse light conditions (outdoor shade, indoor natural light etc.)
We certainly do not live in a light box. But we can't expect sellers not to photograph their pearls to advantage, either. It isn't deception if the colors are actually present in the pearls, even if they only show up under ideal light conditions. As buyers it is up to us to educate ourselves about how pearl colors behave in different lighting. This helps us to have realistic expectations.

We can ask sellers for some natural diffuse light photos-- but I find that even then the pearls may not look the same in my own home. I have Tahitians that look different in every room of my house. Which is the true color? They all are!

I find that Tahitians and colored freshwater pearls are most likely to have overtone colors that are best seen in diffuse light. I factor this into my expectations of how these pearls will look in my own environment.

You may be happier buying pearls in person, but even then, the lighting in the shop or at the jewelry show may affect what the color looks like.
I saw a lovely strand of Tahitians that had fabulous bluish overtones-- that vanished when I took the strand nearer the window.

It can be frustrating to buy pearls.
By the way the pearls in your first post do look like authentic freshwater pearls.

You took a lot of weight off over my mind: I could not tell if they are authentic - meant for real pearls (freshwater pearls). By the book criteria, I did not know what to expect like
Tooth test, or rubbing test
Weight
Warm or cold feeling
Texture- Fakes with glass like feeling vs real pearls
and the list grows on online resources.
They can be very helpful if I was a bit experienced.
Ok, I did not get those lovely purple pearls. Besides still I have authentic pearls and I am all smiles now.

Just as a thinker I am questioning: you are right both parties, customer and seller, must be meticulous in any kind of trading. There are always tactics/tools/applications to deceive people resulting in overpayment. If optimum lighting to be blamed, why does shop-based sellers have less color/shape difference in comparison of their online pictures vs in store?
My experience is that happens only a shop tries to fool the buyer into buying something at wrongful description. Hence, on ETSY, they met highly professionals who will note what you explained about the light usage at shootings. They are honest and if pictures are really color-changing based on environment, they add videos indoors, some both in & out. I try to shop from them. Although I shopped pink to light purple pearls, they did not have that kind of warm Metallic rich purple color shown in the very first picture.
Ironically, ‘pink to light purple’ pearls, paid highest at $60 for a pair of 12mm FW Edison, almost round pearl is similar to $130 pearl pair. The latter and the expensive is not a pair in terms of colors and shape beside my sadness of purple color. Mine is an analysis based on comparison of different resources and sellers as well as platform.

To wrap up: I am in debt for making me so happy with your response. Thank you.

 

[Nihal]

I just want to add this: We have all bought pearls we were less than thrilled with.
Even if they are just what we expected, they may not look as good against our skin as we thought they would.

Therefore it's best to buy from reputable vendors who have generous return policies, and to be prepared to send them back if we don't love what we got.
It's all part of the cost of the hobby.
Edited to add: I don't buy from anywhere I am not prepared to ship back to with tracking. I don't buy from China any more.

I genuinely thank you for all advice down to China - my order is from.

 

[Nihal]

I genuinely thank you for all advice down to China - my order is from.

Thanks again

 

[Pearl Dreams]

I'm glad we could help.
If it's any comfort, even experienced pearl shoppers sometimes have to return pearls that didn't look the way they thought they would. Even when buying from reputable vendors. It's nobody's fault-- pearls are hard to photograph accurately when the colors are complex.

There is a thread on Pricescope.com where people post the vendor's photo and their own photos of the pearls they bought. Mostly it's Tahitians, but you will get the idea.

Tahitian pearls - Vendor vs. IRL pictures

Hi all, I thought it would be a great idea to create a reference thread for folks buying tahitian pearls. So please post pictures from the vendor and your IRL shots of your tahitian pearl purchases and whatever informatin you have about the pearls. If you don't have vendor shots, that's ok...

www.pricescope.com

 

[naturalpearlsource]

Hi,
I am only a pearl-lover since childhood. I recently developed some trust in shopping pearls online. I wish I had known this platform a year ago.
I have been looking for lilac-lavender-purple pearls for a year. Each excitement turned into a big heartbreak due to the colors. I am well aware of the difficulty of taking pearl pictures. For that reason, I try to take all precautions:
1) analyze pics on different screens to evaluate colors, luster, overtones and aurora since each electronics has its own adjustments.
2) read carefully the sellers explanations about the conditions during picturing like indoor, outdoor, natural light source…etc
3) mostly prefer products with videos in addition to the pics.
4) read reviews
5) importantly in case of any discrepancy between the title and description, I stay away from that seller. Let me give you an example (jewelry making) that I frequently see on ETSY > title:
‘14K SOLID GOLD, or REAL GOLD chain for jewelry making’
Then, I scroll down to the product description and features where the seller states that:
‘STERLING SILVER, or (worse) BRASS plated with 14K GOLD’
Above is not acceptable since the title deceives for 14K REAL GOLD. A person lies at the very first step WILL LIE at any step. That is my personal ethics and free-will not shop at that shop. Please no offense, anyone may choose to shop the way they wish. Nothing is only black and white, in fact there are so many grey areas as well as buffering colors in life.
6) I personally take pictures/videos of the received pearls with different conditions, indoor, various light resource, different angles and background (like white, black, against a particular object) to fairly judge pearl color, overtones, aurora, luster and surface quality.

Here is my worry: I paid $130 for a pair of purple pearls - my misfortune to shop at Etsy. Unfortunately those are my 4th attempt to buy lavender-purple pearls in less than 6 months. Again and again feeling deceived. Here is the exact picture from seller - no edit by me. The following pics are the ones I received and pearls are pictured at different angles in the evening and during day, no light is on at the day time, blinds are open, white and black as well as dimly-lighted or shadowed environment. Nothing close to the seller’s pic.

Only when closely pictured pics are more purple but not in reality. They are way muted lighter colors. Although two pearls will never be same, I expected them to be closer in color and shape due being labeled as a pair. In some pics, color difference is very obvious, one is mauve-pink and other is dark bluish purple with no warm purple color, nor pink and metallic overtones. Just reiterating for my pics that pearls in person are way paler and muted colors- not too dark.
Also tested them as I learnt here: tooth test. I am highly inexperienced about the authenticity tests. I could not decide. They don’t feel like scrubbing lightly against a sand with tooth test. I don’t know what degree is enough about gritty described here. Besides, they are not too heavy for that size of pearls and never felt too cold - not warm neither cold in between.
Thus I emailed the seller about the color and my doubts of the authenticity.

It's freshwater edison pearl, but the quality is not same as the pictures online store.