How about a "sticky"?

[mikehrz]

Does anyone else think we need a sticky for this forum containing some faqs? It would make it easier for new forum members to find advice on their prospective purchases. Things like:

-Truly natural (non-cultured) pearls are incredibly rare. Some sellers may declare their pearls to be "natural" simply because they are not imitation or faux pearls. Others dishonestly claim that their pearls are truly natural even though they are cultured. If you find a "natural" item that interests you, ask questions of both the seller and the experts here to ascertain its true nature. Natural pearls are far more valuable than cultured pearls owing to their rarity.

-"Certifications" from "gem laboratories" or the like are usually not worth the paper they're printed on. Especially beware of sellers listing items that are "equivalent quality" to the item submitted to the lab. What this really means is that no supposed "expert" has actually examined the item for sale. This renders what was an already mostly useless "certification" even more so.

-Grading scales are NOT universal. "AAA" or "AAAA" ratings are assigned by each seller individually according to their whim and are NOT comparable to items with a similar rating from other sellers. Like "certifications," grading scales are generally meaningless.

-Feedback is generally irrelevant. The brutally honest truth: If you're here looking for advice on buying pearls on eBay, you're probably not a pearl expert. The vast majority of people buying pearls on eBay are just like you. Even if the seller has lots of positive feedback, most of that feedback probably came from people who aren't pearl experts, and therefore is not a reliable indicator of the quality of the items you can expect from that seller. Who would you rather take advice from: Someone who knows as much (or as little) about pearls as you do, or someone who evaluates and scrutinizes pearls for a living?

-Beware sellers who don't respond to questions. If you went into a brick-and-mortar jewelry store and the salesperson remained mute when questioned, would you buy from them?

-Black pearls do NOT occur naturally. The only common dark-colored pearls are Tahitians, and they have a distinctive look which does not resemble the look of dyed akoya or fw pearls. An oil-slick look is a dead giveaway that the pearls are dyed.

-As in the real world, you get what you pay for on eBay. Good deals can be found, but as in the real world, they're not very common. If it sounds too good to be true... it's probably Chinese freshwater (read "it probably is").

Feel free to make suggestions/comments/rants. I'll edit this post accordingly, as newcomers may or may not go beyond the first post in the thread.

 

[Zeide Erskine]

Dear Mike.

Do you realize that you just declared all dark abalone, pteria sterna, malleus malleus, mytilus edulis, and a whole host of American, European, African, Australian and Asian freshwater pearls fake or dyed (dark to black body color and oil slick effect)?

There are knowledgeable buyers on eBay. You can recognize them by the feedback they leave. Contact other buyers and judge their pearl education. Educate yourself before buying.

And here is some collectors' wisdom. Cultured pearls are cultured pearls. Marine pearls are not superior to freshwater pearls owing to some fundamental principle or even on average. It is the product that counts. The less treatment the better. Bead nuclei are less desirable than no nuclei. Pearls with orient are more valuable than pearls without orient regardless of size or shape. Pearls without orient are only collectible if they are otherwise attractive and rare (e.g. conch, tridacna maxima, melo melo, and placuna sella pearls). Bead nucleated pearls and nacreous pearls without orient are fashion articles. Natural pearls, keshis, and other tissue nucleated pearls are collectible.

Zeide

 

[Caitlin]

Hi Mike
Natural pearls are more rare than diamonds , but I would not make a rule about it in a FAQ. I see a big renaissance of interest in natural pearls, just since I arrived at this forum. I would like to see a LOT more on this subject, though.

There is even an occasional seller/poster on this forum who says (on his webpage) that he tells people cultured pearls are "real" or "natural" because they ........oh well I forget why, but I think that is the issue that needs to be addressed: That Ebayers and even otherwise honest sellers often think it is OK to use "real" or "natural" in their advertising because the bead spent some time in an "oyster" getting some nacre coating.

------yeah and don?t forget this argument: that the MoP bead is really "nacre" too, so that really, really makes cultured pearls "natural"!

If the beads are really ?nacre?, I wonder why they don?t look like pearls? .they just look like Mother of Pearl beads, so I think there is something else going on with MoP that isn?t really ?nacre? as one finds in actual pearls. Otherwise why would they need a dip in the ?oyster? at all? I guess that 90 day minimum dip into an ?oyster? gives a MoP bead the equivalent of a coat of nail polish made of genuine nacre...

I personally love to comb eBay as an educational exercise. For instance looking at what the Mikis are selling for when they have the clasp and paperwork. They get top prices but people are not buying value, they are buying Mystique when they buy a brand name. Mikis are great for Collectors of such things, but I hope by pointing out the final sale prices on these items, smart buyers will see that they can get better pearls at better prices from professional online dealers like some of the sellers here, if they don?t HAVE to have the brand name??.

I really like the ?service? this forum can provide by opining on peoples? eBay questions and examples. Those posts are usually excellent lessons with illustrated examples. That?s why I have actually gone searching for examples to put up here. I look for ones I am pretty sure are honest like the mikis with papers, or pretty sure there is some chicanery going on, but not positive. Then the experts really help develop my "eye" by their comments. You have seen how much Jeremy and Zeide and others here- can see, even in a photo. I think it is a great virtuoso skill, and I am intent on learning something about it from them.

In fact, wouldn?t it be interesting if more of us found and posted really good and really bad Ebay examples? We folks who are earning the titles of ?Pearl Expert? around here by the number of our posts, if not our actual knowledge (and I am the number one example of this) can add even more to the Forum?s educational value by contributing in this vein- esp since we already have a small clue about pearls, then the forum experts can tie it up in bows for the innocents who shop eBay..

 

[mikehrz]

Dear Mike.

Do you realize that you just declared all dark abalone, pteria sterna, malleus malleus, mytilus edulis, and a whole host of American, European, African, Australian and Asian freshwater pearls fake or dyed (dark to black body color and oil slick effect)?

Be that as it may, which do you think is more likely to appear on eBay: dyed pearls being passed off as Tahitians or natural color, or one of these relatively rare, more exotic pearls? However, as I said in the original post, I am certainly open to editing. I would welcome an alternate wording if you have a suggestion.

There are knowledgeable buyers on eBay. You can recognize them by the feedback they leave. Contact other buyers and judge their pearl education. Educate yourself before buying.

A lot of sellers have hundreds, even thousands or tens of thousands of feedback comments. Looking for knowledgeable buyers amongst the laymen seems like it would take a lot longer than asking a question here. Remember, the thread was aimed at newcomers, those lacking knowledge about pearls. They may not be in a position to accurately gauge someone's level of expertise. I've edited the wording a bit, though, to make it slightly less forceful.

And here is some collectors' wisdom. Cultured pearls are cultured pearls. Marine pearls are not superior to freshwater pearls owing to some fundamental principle or even on average. It is the product that counts. The less treatment the better. Bead nuclei are less desirable than no nuclei. Pearls with orient are more valuable than pearls without orient regardless of size or shape. Pearls without orient are only collectible if they are otherwise attractive and rare (e.g. conch, tridacna maxima, melo melo, and placuna sella pearls). Bead nucleated pearls and nacreous pearls without orient are fashion articles. Natural pearls, keshis, and other tissue nucleated pearls are collectible.

Zeide

With your permission, I'll add this paragraph verbatim to the original post (properly credited of course). A brief definition of "orient" might also help.

Hi Mike
Natural pearls are more rare than diamonds , but I would not make a rule about it in a FAQ. I see a big renaissance of interest in natural pearls, just since I arrived at this forum. I would like to see a LOT more on this subject, though.

There is even an occasional seller/poster on this forum who says (on his webpage) that he tells people cultured pearls are "real" or "natural" because they ........oh well I forget why, but I think that is the issue that needs to be addressed: That Ebayers and even otherwise honest sellers often think it is OK to use "real" or "natural" in their advertising because the bead spent some time in an "oyster" getting some nacre coating.

This is certainly someting that needs to be addressed. I'll edit the wording.

In fact, wouldn’t it be interesting if more of us found and posted really good and really bad Ebay examples? We folks who are earning the titles of “Pearl Expert” around here by the number of our posts, if not our actual knowledge (and I am the number one example of this) can add even more to the Forum’s educational value by contributing in this vein- esp since we already have a small clue about pearls, then the forum experts can tie it up in bows for the innocents who shop eBay..

Since you post more than I do, I must be the number two example of this. Actually, I just found this example of a meaningless grading scale:
http://cgi.ebay.com/FW-AAAA-lavende...8939756311QQcategoryZ3844QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
These AAAA+ pearls must be a heck of a lot better than the AAA fw you can buy elsewhere, huh? and for a starting bid of only $9.99, too. (insert vomiting smilie here)

I also wanted to add something to the original post regarding the relationship between clasp quality and pearl quality. With my level of knowledge, though, I'm not totally comfortable composing such a statement. Help would be appreciated.

 

[Caitlin]

And here is some collectors' wisdom:
- Cultured pearls are cultured pearls. Marine pearls are not superior to freshwater pearls owing to some fundamental principle or even on average. It is the product that counts.
-The less treatment the better.
-Bead nuclei are less desirable than no nuclei.
-Pearls with orient are more valuable than pearls without orient regardless of size or shape.
-Pearls without orient are only collectible if they are otherwise attractive and rare (e.g. conch, tridacna maxima, melo melo, and placuna sella pearls).
-Bead nucleated pearls and nacreous pearls without orient are fashion articles.
-Natural pearls, keshis, and other tissue nucleated pearls are collectible

I thought this comment should be formatted for easy reading- so i did it. If you paste this up above, I'll delete this post.

 

[Caitlin]

Look at this oil slick color:

Someone besides Zeide tell me what these are and if they are natural or dyed. I already know Zeide knows what they are.

This is a case where the oil slick looks great on my computer- I took the picture- but isn't as loud online--ok Mike help me here......