A few Q's from a novice:)

[m4816k]

Hy everybody,

I'm a new member, a relative beginner when it comes to knowledge of pearls, so I'd have about a zillion questions, but for now I'll settle for only a few answers
1. I read numerous articles on pearls, but many are contradictory, and I'm especially confused when it comes to overtone/orient. One article I read, states that only dark pearls have orient, while light ones have overtone, and some other states the opposite. Another states that only saltwater ones have orient (regardless of color), and that no freshwater can have orient (but it can have an overtone), again regardless of color. I also read that orient can't be immitated and that it's a clear sign that the pearl is genuine, and that it's saltwater. Also, while browsing this forum I encountered aditional new terms such as "mirror" and "water", so a brief intro on them would also be appreciated.
2. Again somewhere I read that the finest FWP's can match the looks of the best SSP's (and even their size). That is mostly stated on websites that sell FWP's, and I'm suspicious of such claims. It's also stated that those pearls command a premium price - just how premium are we talking about? Is there a photo that would proove such claims, like a side by side comparison?
3. On some tv documentary I heard that the best cultured SSP and tahitians can fetch prices of up to US$10k a piece. That sounds a bit blown out of proportions, so I have to ask is it true, and what's so special about those pearls, since I see nothing wrong with tahitians being offered for 200$ a piece?
4. Is any kind of natural pearls available anywhere except in auction houses and antique shops? Are they always expensive (even freshwater ones)?
Bare with me, I don't know much, so I may ask a stupid question now and then

Thanks,

Marijan from Croatia

 

[knotty panda]

Dear Marijan: Welcome to the forum. I am the queen of dumb questions and I have found everyone on this forum to be truly wonderful and patient folks, no matter how many times they have answered each question. There is a wonderful explanation of mirror, orient, and water on this forum which I believe Caitlin authored. I'll see if I can find it for you. And again, welcome!

 

[Sueki]

Good Heavens, Knotty,
Couldn't you sleep ?
And welcome, Marijan.
Sorry I can't help - I'm new here, too.
But I can tell you that you will find pearls are increasingly addictive now that you have discovered this forum !
Having been perfectly content with my old, inherited pearls for years, I now find myself looking at pearl jewellery wherever I go....

 

[jshepherd]

Welcome to the forum, Marijan.

Well your first question definitely shows a bit of confusion. Not just on your end, however.

The first thing you must understand is the real definition of orient and how that compares to overtone. Unfortunately, the assertions in your first part are all wrong.

Orient is a value factor often described by sellers of all types of pearl sellers. But the fact is, orient is a very rare value factor, and very few pearls will ever exhibit orient.

Orient is responsible for the play of light that seems to change colors on the surface of a pearl. It is often most noticeable in Tahitian pearls, especially those of peacock coloration. But it is certainly found in white pearls as well. Orient is caused when light enters the surface of a pearl. The surface of the pearl is composed of scale-like platelets. These platelets (of nacre) diffract the light off the linear side, causing this play of light.

Now this is one thing that many find confusing - orient is not a value factor typically associated with Akoya pearls. It is most often found in Tahitian pearls and in freshwater pearls. In high-end freshwater pearls orient can be very visible. It is evident in all natural colors of freshwater pearl.

Q: So is orient found in white or black pearls?
A: No, it is found in both.

Q: Can only saltwater pearls have orient?
A: No. In fact most saltwater pearls do not have orient. Orient is more common in freshwater pearls.

Q: Can orient be imitated?
A: It will not be true orient, but it can be close. The play of light on Akoya is typically a result of treatment (not light diffraction through the platelets). Well-made fakes (like Majorica) appear to have orient.

The finest freshwater pearls can match the finest South Sea pearls. The main difference will typically be the size. Freshwater pearls of fine quality are rarely larger than 11mm. This is a small size in the South Sea arena. On a size for size comparison, however, freshwater pearls can compare in cost to that of a South Sea strand. There are many photos of freshwater pearls on this forum. There are many comparison photos as well. I cannot direct you to all of them as there are thousands of pages here, but you can find them if you dig a bit.

Yes, there are South Sea and Tahitian pearls that can go for as much as $10,000 apiece. How would these compare to a $200 pearl? How would you compare a diamond that is valued at $50,000 retail, and one that is valued at $1000 retail? A pearl costing $10,000 would not only be of remarkable quality, it would be of remarkable size, likely larger than 17mm.

When prices drop too low for Tahitian pearls it is wise to be wary. You are not going to find a round Tahitian necklace for $300, for example. This would be a freshwater or Akoya. On a farm level Tahitian and South sea prices are very much the same from location to location. The difference in selling price accounts for the buyers relative proximity to the source. But the price will never drop below source pricing.

The only natural pearls available today on a commercial scale are the exotics. Pearls from conch and abalone are two such examples. The pearls you are probably envisaging, white round strands of pearls, are almost exclusively available in auction houses as antiques.

This thread is probably going to invite a lot of discussion. Unfortunately I am heading to the airport and will be off the board for a short while.

 

[m4816k]

Welcome to the forum, Marijan.

Well your first question definitely shows a bit of confusion. Not just on your end, however.

The first thing you must understand is the real definition of orient and how that compares to overtone. Unfortunately, the assertions in your first part are all wrong.

Orient is a value factor often described by sellers of all types of pearl sellers. But the fact is, orient is a very rare value factor, and very few pearls will ever exhibit orient.

Orient is responsible for the play of light that seems to change colors on the surface of a pearl. It is often most noticeable in Tahitian pearls, especially those of peacock coloration. But it is certainly found in white pearls as well. Orient is caused when light enters the surface of a pearl. The surface of the pearl is composed of scale-like platelets. These platelets (of nacre) diffract the light off the linear side, causing this play of light.

Now this is one thing that many find confusing - orient is not a value factor typically associated with Akoya pearls. It is most often found in Tahitian pearls and in freshwater pearls. In high-end freshwater pearls orient can be very visible. It is evident in all natural colors of freshwater pearl.

Q: So is orient found in white or black pearls?
A: No, it is found in both.

Q: Can only saltwater pearls have orient?
A: No. In fact most saltwater pearls do not have orient. Orient is more common in freshwater pearls.

Q: Can orient be imitated?
A: It will not be true orient, but it can be close. The play of light on Akoya is typically a result of treatment (not light diffraction through the platelets). Well-made fakes (like Majorica) appear to have orient.

The finest freshwater pearls can match the finest South Sea pearls. The main difference will typically be the size. Freshwater pearls of fine quality are rarely larger than 11mm. This is a small size in the South Sea arena. On a size for size comparison, however, freshwater pearls can compare in cost to that of a South Sea strand. There are many photos of freshwater pearls on this forum. There are many comparison photos as well. I cannot direct you to all of them as there are thousands of pages here, but you can find them if you dig a bit.

Yes, there are South Sea and Tahitian pearls that can go for as much as $10,000 apiece. How would these compare to a $200 pearl? How would you compare a diamond that is valued at $50,000 retail, and one that is valued at $1000 retail? A pearl costing $10,000 would not only be of remarkable quality, it would be of remarkable size, likely larger than 17mm.

When prices drop too low for Tahitian pearls it is wise to be wary. You are not going to find a round Tahitian necklace for $300, for example. This would be a freshwater or Akoya. On a farm level Tahitian and South sea prices are very much the same from location to location. The difference in selling price accounts for the buyers relative proximity to the source. But the price will never drop below source pricing.

The only natural pearls available today on a commercial scale are the exotics. Pearls from conch and abalone are two such examples. The pearls you are probably envisaging, white round strands of pearls, are almost exclusively available in auction houses as antiques.

This thread is probably going to invite a lot of discussion. Unfortunately I am heading to the airport and will be off the board for a short while.

Thank you for all the explenations and answers, but I have more First let me just mention that I know what overtone and orient look like, since I've seen (mostly on photos) how each looks, but I was just confused about when and in what types of pearls they appear. And now to questions.
1. Since you say that orient is evident in all natural colors of FWP's, does that mean that a dyed pearl cannot show it, due to color coating?
2. About the FW vs. SS, you asked how would I compare a 50k diamond to a 1k, so let me answer that it's quite possible for those two to be a perfect match in terms of quality, since they can show identical color and clarity grades, and that the only visible diference could (in theory) be the size. So, is that the same with pearls - would a 10k one have better luster, color, shape...or would just be bigger in size than those selling for a few hundred $ (I've seen a 400$ tahitian WG pendant with chain, and it's hard for me to imagine a better quality than the one in that piece, although it wasn't very big - about 10 mm if memory serves me)?

 

[jshepherd]

Dyed pearls can give off the appearance of orient. I believe Pattye just posted a picture of a strand that does. Finding true orient that is not a product of the the dyes, however, may be a different story.

In relation to the value, for a single pearl to cost $10,000 (except under very high retail conditions), it does need to be large. There is also the factor of quality. With South Sea and Tahitian pearls, smaller pearls tend to be of higher grade. Especially with Tahitians, once you pass the 12mm range, the overall quality tends to drop. I am not saying that you cannot get great pearls in this size if buying at the same grade, but in terms of percentages of production, the quality drops. This is because as the sizes go up, you start dealing in 2nd and 3rd graft pearls. These pearls near universally of lower grade than their predecessors.

What this means is that a high grade Tahitian of 9mm is quite common. But a high grade Tahitian of 16mm is very rare, even though there is a sizable production. This is very similar to the way diamond value appreciates the size increases. You can get great stones at $350 a carat - if they are smaller than 5 points each.

 

[SteveM]

Hy everybody,

4. Is any kind of natural pearls available anywhere except in auction houses and antique shops? Are they always expensive (even freshwater ones)?

Thanks,

Marijan from Croatia

Marijan,

Welcome from another relatively new member. Asking the same question resulted in my presence here, after being astounded by the continuing commericalization of pipi pearls in the Cook Islands. These are the original SS golden pearls, although much smaller than the average for cultureds, with anything over 5-6mm considered huge. My experience and ongoing explorations of the subject comprise the posts in my thread 'Pinctada Maculata.'

The same curiosity has me exploring abalones, conch, melo melo, etc. and the advent of untreated freshwater pearls looks to be of great interest as well.


Steve
Seattle